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Post by ManaSeed on Feb 15, 2015 5:17:48 GMT
Its kinda funny cause I got bored with HELE3 because it wouldn't let me zip around. The Quadcop designs were meant to give more power and mobility. It accomplished that easier than I had hoped so I never spent much time testing with it. Maybe its because I've tweaked it to my liking, or that I've flown endless bad variants, but I found I could correct for the flaws of quadcop2F quite easily myself. I posted it hastily and moved onto my next project. This little gem is left over from the Quadcop projects. You might like it, I personally find it impractical, but I might explore the stabilizing properties of it further some time later. It was a quick little test so its not perfect and some adjustments might need to be made to get it flying better. Thanks for the model. It is not bad as I see a lot propellers work in opposite direction to counteract the force generated, in order to achieve stability. This has definitely impressed me again. However, not sure if it’s heavier now, it becomes less stable as it’s harder to correct its position when titled. Once again I realize how impressive HELE3’s stabilizing system is, simple and overwhelming effective (in balancing). Here’s an interesting thing. With a lot of parts and being completely symmetric (whether you cut it horizontally or vertically), it pulls pranks on your eyes. What happens if you take a sip of drink or look away from the monitor for a short moment while maneuvering this machine? You’ll have completely no idea about its orientation, until you understand why it moves backward while you’re pressing forward. Not to mention you have to pay 120% attention to it when you rotate the camera.
P.S. Yes I agree that a perfectly working elevator can't travel to see the beautiful sunset at ocean nor bombard an enemy which is only 2 inches in front of you. So I'm still looking for a solution to settle the struggle between mobility and stability. To be precise, I’m shamelessly waiting someone else’s dream machine that can switch between thruster mode and hover mode XP How did you attach the 4 top propellers on the wheels ? Ahhh, I was wondering when someone would notice. Here's how it's done. 1) Place a wheel. 2) Place a block (any kind) on that wheel 3) Connect propellers to all 4 sides of that cube 4) Remove cube 5) Add wheel where the cube was.
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Post by Praesumo on Feb 15, 2015 5:58:14 GMT
How did you attach the 4 top propellers on the wheels ? No, everything is great. You just have to move the cursor over the place you want to put the piece and click very fast (before the indicator turns red). This can be done without any tricks, but here's a video tutorial I made that shows how to accomplish this easier (should help in all cases, but is more noticeable on slower machines) Let me know if you're still having trouble.
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Post by assassinactual on Feb 15, 2015 8:16:18 GMT
how did you get your propellers on the wheels and not on blocks?
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Post by Praesumo on Feb 15, 2015 8:40:45 GMT
how did you get your propellers on the wheels and not on blocks? Dear lord. The answer to your question is literally in the very comment above yours. Did you even look??
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Post by ManaSeed on Feb 15, 2015 9:05:39 GMT
This can be done without any tricks, but here's a video tutorial I made that shows how to accomplish this easier (should help in all cases, but is more noticeable on slower machines) Let me know if you're still having trouble. Hmm… “this can be done without any tricks” yet I've failed to do it. Then you must be implying I’m a dummy, right? I’m so angry I’m going to stomp you with Praesumo’s Striders. Ahem, well…. to be a little serious, I wouldn’t call it a hidden bug or tricky glitch. I call it urban myth. Who would have figured you have to be fast? LOL P.S. Assassinactual actually did that on purpose. It seemed like a satire against your statement about “this can be done without any tricks”, but in reality it was an act of justice to reprimand you for calling me a dummy XP ==================================================================== @any kind and charming userI know the primary purpose of the suspension is to act as landing skids. Not sure if I’m imagining things, I find it slightly more stable to have the suspension while flying in the air, rather than without it. It seems the machine trembles/shakes slightly lesser (just a little bit though). But I know it’s like asking a silly question: Does it make a chopper’s flight more stable if you superglue some metal spring on its surface? I’m just curious. By the way, if I want to learn how different aviation parts/blocks work, is it appropriate to ask here? Or can you redirect me to the proper thread?
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Post by duuude on Feb 15, 2015 9:34:46 GMT
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Post by vandom on Feb 15, 2015 9:53:14 GMT
Yes I agree that a perfectly working elevator can't travel to see the beautiful sunset at ocean nor bombard an enemy which is only 2 inches in front of you. So I'm still looking for a solution to settle the struggle between mobility and stability. To be precise, I’m shamelessly waiting someone else’s dream machine that can switch between thruster mode and hover mode XP Well look no further! One dream machine that can switch between hover and thruster mode coming up! The BadDream.bsg (18.47 KB) Hover 5 Lift 5+8 Lower 5+v Roll right/left pitch up/down yaw 6/4 SWITCH MODES! 7/H Unfortunately it doesn't matter how many springs I add to this puppy it just sucks. The larger these things get the less stable they seem to be. I had high hopes for thruster mode I really did, but it moves slower than simply pitching it forwards, and like all my planes, and I think someone else mentioned this too, it becomes stupidly unstable. Praesumos stabilizing main rotor just isn't cutting it for these multi rotor designs. Not really sure where to go from here, kinda feel like my ideas bucket is empty.
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Post by Redstoneman on Feb 15, 2015 13:18:47 GMT
Imma share my Osprey with you guys. It may not qualify as a strict helicopter, but: 1. It works 2. It's fast (when you use the Osprey's signature ability) 3. It's stable I'm working on a prototype that could tilt its rotors all the way forward without dropping dead to the ground. I'll post it here if I succeed. Also great work on your helicopters, Praesumo! besiege.freeforums.net/thread/878/osprey-more-destructionGL HF
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Post by duuude on Feb 15, 2015 13:50:44 GMT
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Post by ManaSeed on Feb 15, 2015 15:37:58 GMT
Well look no further! One dream machine that can switch between hover and thruster mode coming up! Hover 5 Lift 5+8 Lower 5+v Roll right/left pitch up/down yaw 6/4 SWITCH MODES! 7/H Unfortunately it doesn't matter how many springs I add to this puppy it just sucks. The larger these things get the less stable they seem to be. I had high hopes for thruster mode I really did, but it moves slower than simply pitching it forwards, and like all my planes, and I think someone else mentioned this too, it becomes stupidly unstable. Praesumos stabilizing main rotor just isn't cutting it for these multi rotor designs. Not really sure where to go from here, kinda feel like my ideas bucket is empty. You call it BadDream, huh? 3/10, this name is not funn- Then I saw this. LOLDo you have to go as far as exploiting that? I laughed because I realized you tried really hard and probably tried almost every potentially viable idea. I guess everyone knows that in most cases contractible spring and brace are intangible in the sense that a blade can go through them without damaging them at all. It’s probably not intended by developers. But can you imagine how complex things can be if we have yoyo in besiege? Can you imagine what those crazy people can do with it? Incidentally, I’ve tried adding contractible spring to my flying machine (by exploiting the intangibility). Then I gave up on this idea forever. Even if it works (not to mention it isn’t), I just can’t…. it’s not about me being picky about aesthetic… it’s not about messy….. I just…. can’t do this. orz It interests me when I look at the design and every little thing about your machine. Is there any logic or underlying physic theory to support your ideas? If it’s all layman’s creativity and passion, I’m so impressed by your varied attempts. Phew. How many times have I said the word “impressed”? I used to think someone will build this in near future. But after I’ve seen some videos, I changed my mind. So when you mentioned that your new machine can actually switch modes, I was very happy. Because I was expecting something like this. P.S. Feel free to take a good break from your chopper development project, you deserve it. Well, it’s not like you can solve the mystery of universe even if you brainstorm alone for 24 hours XD
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Post by asasinator50 on Feb 15, 2015 18:23:01 GMT
I could help but try to update it. I edited yours and made some new controls to help. Same controls as yours: Shift = Thrust Q/E = Roll Left/Rght U/O = Tilt rotor forward/back (This is the trick. Tilting it forward some allows for more stable forward flight!) I/K = Down/UP J/L = Left/Right R = Drop Bomb But I added: Right Shift = Increase Altitude (Go Up) / = Decrease Altitude (Go Down) I also replaced some blocks with ballasts to keep the weight distribution the same. ApacheAttackHeli2.bsg (18.84 KB)
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Post by vandom on Feb 15, 2015 20:51:40 GMT
It interests me when I look at the design and every little thing about your machine. Is there any logic or underlying physic theory to support your ideas? No special physics, just a challenge by a friend to not use the flying block at all which I have continued with all designs. I don't care to make them look pretty by copying real life helicopter designs, I just use the least amount of blocks to simplify things. I actually had a much cooler tilt system for the rotors initially, however I settled on a simple light one for bad dream. It's kind of depressing how the more small and simple solutions are generally the ones that work the best. duude your little light copter was a joy to fly. These large monsters cause so much frustration to build and fly. Redstoneman I love the look and smoothness of flight for your osprey. Im getting a lot of rocking forwards and backwards, is that user error? Didn't even know you could toggle stuff, had my head stuck up in the clouds and I guess I missed some important stuff.
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Post by laenco on Feb 15, 2015 21:41:38 GMT
Hello to all) Please, take a look at this two-screwed heli. Sorry for such a crude thing, but this variant is kinda cool for me. heli_2screws.bsg (6.07 KB) Controls: Left\Right - increase\decrease attack angle of main rotor o - default thing for small rotors [8]/[5] - pitch [4]/[6] - kinda roll [7]/[9] - roll With the help of small rotors is able to take off and fly with 6 bombs. Also - fits into the bounding box.
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Post by Redstoneman on Feb 15, 2015 23:58:30 GMT
Redstoneman I love the look and smoothness of flight for your osprey. Im getting a lot of rocking forwards and backwards, is that user error? Didn't even know you could toggle stuff, had my head stuck up in the clouds and I guess I missed some important stuff. Thanks a lot! I guess it's always nice to read the update notes xD To answer your question, I honestly think that's an error on your side, but then again, I mash I all the time to keep it stabilized. It takes little effort, but a lot of getting used to. Another possibility is that you didn't tilt the rotors a few degrees forward (like I described in the Controls section in my thread). It boosts the Osprey's speed a little and helps with stabilization. I really need to make ma boi a little lighter anyway. The armed version has very limited ascending speed because of all the wood and bracing.
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Post by Praesumo on Feb 16, 2015 0:11:52 GMT
Another possibility is that you didn't tilt the rotors a few degrees forward (like I described in the Controls section in my thread). It boosts the Osprey's speed a little and helps with stabilization. THISI'm almost certain no one ever reads the controls or control-tips before using a machine. I've seen at least THREE videos now where streamers or youtubers have used my Apache helicopter, but didn't seem to have any clue of the controls. One of those people took 10 in-game minutes to figure out that you can press 1 to tilt the rotors and take off. (He thought it just...hovered, i guess???) It's so frustrating to watch people use something you created to work a certain way TOTALLY wrong. I have yet to see anyone properly tilt the main rotors forward before trying to move forward in my Apache. Sounds like your design has a similar feature. It makes flying forward so much more stable and fast...yet NO-ONE ever does it! It's frustrating to watch people take off and then just mash the forward key, so the tail lifts (and hits the main rotors that SHOULD have been tilted) and then they just say something like "Oh well, I guess the design isn't that good! Look, the rotors just fall off when I go forward!" (AAAAAARGH!)
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